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Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger

Posted by pb 
pb
Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 05:21PM
Okay. I'm a geezer. And, except for reruns, this is too old even for me.

Remember the old Perry Mason Show?

Perry was a criminal defense attorney extraordinaire. The show ran over 250 episodes. Week after week, his client seemed to be guilty of a crime. The client would be arrested by Lieutenant Tragg and prosecuted by Perry's regular opponent, District Attorney Hamilton Burger.

Week after week, the prosecution would present its case. And, in episode after episode, it seemed impossible that Perry'd find away to keep his, by all appearances, guilty client out of jail, or worse, the gas chamber.

As Burger presented his case, witness after witness built a compelling case. All of the prosecution's witnesses sang the same tune. The evidence was real and undeniable. Every witness was sincere and honest. Burger believed in his evidence. He believed in the defendant's guilt. Often, the prosecutor was motivated by righteous indignation. He was fueled by a commitment to justice.

Yet, after Burger presented his case, Perry had an opportunity to present another explanation of the evidence to judge and jury. And...to present the evidence the prosecution ignored.

The viewer of a Perry Mason episode learned to wait to hear the full story because there always is another side to the story.

As compelling as Burger's interpretation of the evidence seemed to be, there always was another way to interpret the facts. There always was more evidence.

Our friends here: Po, Donna and Curt apparently never watched Perry turn the tables on Hamilton Burger, or they're so intoxicated by their own bloodlust that they don't want to consider that there may be more to the impeachment story than they want to admit.

Adam Schiff, as he engineers the impeachment train, seems every bit as convinced and righteous as was the, ultimately hapless, District Attorney who prosecuted Perry's innocent clients. Yet, Po, Donna and Curt have already deliberated and voted guilty.

Two thoughts:

1. As tempting as it may be to think that all of the evidence in the Trump impeachment saga is known, there's probably more to the story.

2. I haven't ever suggested that Trump shouldn't be impeached only that it's extremely likely that much more will be known by the time the entire story is told by both sides.

Actually, many people don't know that Perry didn't always win his case.

I'm very able to believe that Trump might be impeachable.

But, I know enough to wait until it's likely that all the cards are on the table. That's not happened yet. Not by a long shot.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 05:42PM
So if I am hearing you right, you simply will not look at any of the evidence at all until the whole thing is finished...? Then you'll be willing to look at the evidence and make a decision about what your opinion is...?

pb, you are also seemingly laboring under the misapprehension that Curt, Donna, or I would ignore any truly exculpatory evidence if it was ever presented. I would absolutely love to see some. I've been begging for someone to present some in here. It's just that so far, in the face of a gigantic pile of damning evidence and testimony that shows Individual-1 to be incredibly guilty, no one in his cult has been able to present a single shred of anything that is exculpatory for him in the slightest. It's just hard to imagine what there might be that they haven't been able to find in their desperate flailings to defend their Glorious Orange Leader.

.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:02PM
pb, you are also seemingly laboring under the misapprehension that Curt, Donna, or I would ignore any truly exculpatory evidence if it was ever presented.

No. Don't buy it, po. It's an apprehension.

You have made it clear that the evidence at hand satisfies you.

The way that the House Dems are handling the impeachment thing, Perry Mason won't be able to make his case until the Senate gets the case. And, that's fine with you and already passing judgment. You're convinced knowing only Hamilton Burger's case.

You're constantly criticizing me for ignoring the mountain of evidence already at hand.

Of course, I'm willing to consider the evidence at hand. What I'm not willing to do is pass judgment only on Hamilton Burger's case.

You're itchin to pull the trigger.

I'm circumspect. You ain't.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:20PM
Bad read on US (again). So far, nothing that's been leaked from the closed-door hearings indicates that the Republicans who were part of the questioning have uncovered anything that refutes the testimonies of any of the people they've questioned, who btw have all corroborated each others' testimonies. That's why all we're hearing from the Republicans is a lot if fist pounding and meritless complaints regarding procedure.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:24PM
"You have made it clear that the evidence at hand satisfies you." -pb

I was convinced that this man was a wantonly corrupt con man before he was even elected. My mind was long ago settled on his character and just what he is capable of. All based on more and more evidence that constantly comes to light almost every day for over three years that does nothing but thoroughly corroborate my already made up mind about him. So when I see a mountain of evidence about a specific crime he committed without a molecule of anything even remotely exculpatory provided by his devoted defenders, I'm not going to lose any sleep worrying that this one time I just might be wrong about him. That this one time maybe he didn't commit the crime that all the evidence so far proves he committed.

I'm quite comfortable playing those odds.

Perry Mason has been absolutely silent so far, pb. This hasn't been a take turns kinda thing. Ignoring of course that the GOP has had exactly as much time to call and cross examine witnesses and present evidence. Mason has been perfectly free to toot his horn and make whatever case to the public he wants to with whatever he thinks is exculpatory evidence in response to the wildly damning evidence that has come to light so far. And apparently, he hasn't got a single thing that has been helpful to Individual-1 at all. That's not the Democrats' fault. My guess is that he already knows that this is gonna be one of the cases that he ends up losing. Badly in fact.


"Of course, I'm willing to consider the evidence at hand" -pb

Then what is stopping you? You've never made any indication that you have read a sentence of it. In fact, quite the opposite.

.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:35PM
Quote
Donna
Bad read on US (again). So far, nothing that's been leaked from the closed-door hearings indicates that the Republicans who were part of the questioning have uncovered anything that refutes the testimonies of any of the people they've questioned, who btw have all corroborated each others' testimonies. That's why all we're hearing from the Republicans is a lot if fist pounding and meritless complaints regarding procedure.

Donna,

Back in the day, I'd watch Burger lay out his case and, knowing how the show would probably end, wonder what the rest of the case might be.

And, I learned that, as compelling as the evidence may be, you don't know the whole story until you know the whole story.

I'm aware that the Trump thing could, very well, go like the Nixon thing went and that, when the whole story's known, it will be more obvious than it SEEMS now that Trump must be impeached.

But, I also know that there's going to be a lot more to the story than is known now.

The three of you seem awfully anxious to pass judgment.

And, I can see no legitimate reason to so that so early in the process based on what's going on behind closed doors.

Don't you think it's foolish to conclude that what's been leaked is necessarily reliable or even representative of all that is known?
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:35PM
It's also foolhardy to believe that Perry Mason episodes portray what typically happens in criminal cases.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:39PM
To your last line, in these particular proceedings, no.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:41PM
Of course, I'm willing to consider the evidence at hand" -pb

Then what is stopping you? You've never made any indication that you have read a sentence of it. In fact, quite the opposite.

I'm willing to consider it. What I'm not willing to do is pass judgment based on it.

You are prejudging.

In the purest sense of the word, you are prejudiced. Shame on you!
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:42PM
Quote
Donna
To your last line, in these particular proceedings, no.

Yikes. Why?
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:45PM
This forum isn't a courtroom, pb. One of the things all sides like to do on this forum ( and actually on all political forums ) is speculate.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 06:46PM
Why? Because the testimonies have all been so corroborative.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2019 06:46PM by Donna.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 07:06PM
"I'm willing to consider it. What I'm not willing to do is pass judgment based on it." -pb

So are you still in the considering if you'll even look at it phase...? How can you consider something you refuse to even examine?


"This forum isn't a courtroom, pb. One of the things all sides like to do on this forum ( and actually on all political forums ) is speculate." -Donna

pb likes to speculate quite often in here. He's actually perfectly happy not reserving judgement a lot. He will make prognostications based on evidence he has considered and he makes declarations and pass judgement about certain outcomes all the time. And always when he knows he is right. He even loves parading around crowing about it on any occasion when he is. We're just not allowed to do the same thing is all. sad smiley

It's only when he isn't sure of an outcome, or doesn't like what the likely outcome will be that he starts blathering on about how others should be reserving judgement like he does. He's not sure, so therefore no one else should be.

Disingenuous cuss.

.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 07:18PM
The Hamilton Burgers in this saga are clearly Devin Nunes, Jim Jordan and other Republicans attempting to defend Trump. Like Burger they constantly whine about the "process", the opposing side's theatrics, and are consistently two steps behind.

Trump WILL be impeached. After a preliminary trial in the lower court of the US Senate, Trump's fate will be decided in a higher court: the US electorate next November. The televised proceedings will provide the voters plenty of evidence on which we can base our judgement.

Incidentally one of the arguments that Republicans have been using is that the Democrats are trying to undo the 2016 election. It is a safe conclusion that Trump will not be convicted in the Senate, but if he is will be thanks to the Republicans. The most likely outcome is that voters will realize their error of 2016.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 08:02PM
pb likes to speculate quite often in here. He's actually perfectly happy not reserving judgement a lot. He will make prognostications based on evidence he has considered...

Big difference. All the difference in the world!

I'll predict that the House will impeach Trump but I won't pass judgment on him myself when there's still so much unsaid and done.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 08:40PM
Quote
Curt Anderson
The Hamilton Burgers in this saga are clearly Devin Nunes, Jim Jordan and other Republicans attempting to defend Trump. Like Burger they constantly whine about the "process", the opposing side's theatrics, and are consistently two steps behind.

Trump WILL be impeached. After a preliminary trial in the lower court of the US Senate, Trump's fate will be decided in a higher court: the US electorate next November. The televised proceedings will provide the voters plenty of evidence on which we can base our judgement.

Incidentally one of the arguments that Republicans have been using is that the Democrats are trying to undo the 2016 election. It is a safe conclusion that Trump will not be convicted in the Senate, but if he is will be thanks to the Republicans. The most likely outcome is that voters will realize their error of 2016.

I think you're wrong about Hamilton Burger. He was a good guy, just nearly always wrong.

The good guy part is where my link to Adam Schiff breaks down.

I'm inclined to agree with your view of the 2020 election. However, when the GOP Senate controls the process, a more positive image of Trump will certainly appear than
from the moment's dastardly Dem- driven process.

But, will it be enough?
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 08:44PM
If memory serves Burger won a case or two. But I agree with pb's assessment to date - Schiff was the guy who said he had seen damning evidence in the Russia, Russia, Russia portion of this TV show (which is all it is, btw) - and what did we get? A doddering old Robert Mueller who didn't even know what was in his own report.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 08:48PM
But I agree with pb's assessment to date... Indy!

I'll mark this date in my diary.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 08:53PM
The asterisk being Burger won a case or two - so even an incompetent blowhard like Schiff might pull one off too.

Indy's 2 cents? I can tell you in the end the Ds will lose. I don't even need to follow this impeachment thing to know what's what - history is on my side. The Ds ALWAYS find a way to lose. They are the masters at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory... just ask Hillary. eye rolling smiley
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 09:00PM
Quote
pb
But I agree with pb's assessment to date... Indy!

I'll mark this date in my diary.

Indy has been drifting toward the Dark Side for some time now.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 09:07PM
Quote
Indy!
The asterisk being Burger won a case or two - so even an incompetent blowhard like Schiff might pull one off too.

Indy's 2 cents? I can tell you in the end the Ds will lose. I don't even need to follow this impeachment thing to know what's what - history is on my side. The Ds ALWAYS find a way to lose. They are the masters at snatching defeat from the jaws of victory... just ask Hillary. eye rolling smiley

The Hillary part rubs salt in Curt's still raw wound.

I think that Perry lost 3 cases...out of 270+. That probably corresponds with Schiff's chances.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 09:47PM
Exactly. I think we've seen Curt finally come out of his shell. In the past he at least TRIED to pretend he was a little left. Now he refers to progressives as "the Dark Side". smiling smiley
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 09:50PM
Quote
Indy!
Exactly. I think we've seen Curt finally come out of his shell. In the past he at least TRIED to pretend he was a little left. Now he refers to progressives as "the Dark Side". smiling smiley

Maybe. But, I think, in this case, he's driven by hate of the guy who defeated his beloved, Hillary.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 10:08PM
He’s a pencil neck loser who claimed he had “more than circumstantial evidence” of Trump/Russia collusion. This is the clown you’re placing your faith in...
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 10:21PM
Quote
tuk22
He’s a pencil neck loser who claimed he had “more than circumstantial evidence” of Trump/Russia collusion. This is the clown you’re placing your faith in...

The fact po, D and Curt trust so deeply in Schiff suggests that this is much more wish than realism-based expectation. As Indy! notes, Schiff seriously dropped the ball on Russia.

Putting so many eggs in a basket being handled by this guy seems foolish to me.

I still suspect that he'll be eaten alive when the process goes public, even though he has as much control as he has over the House process.

Then, of course, there's the fact that, after he's done his best, the GOPs control the process in the Senate.

In the end, we may be confusing Lindsey Graham with Perry Mason.

Trump may very well deserve to be impeached for all I know but with Schiff in charge,...?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2019 10:26PM by pb.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 10:43PM
PB,
You've already agreed with most people and predicted that the House will impeach Trump. In other words, you are predicting that Schiff will win the first round.

When the Senate trial happens, and Trump's conviction is at stake, there will be outside lawyers making the case for and against Trump. Think Archibald Cox and Leon Jaworski.

Quote

All senators must be present and, in a break from norms and nature, they must remain silent. McConnell said after the meeting this “should be good therapy for a number of them.”

House lawyers would serve the role of prosecutors, while White House lawyers would be defense counsel. Supreme Court Chief Justice John Roberts would act as judge. Senators would serve as the jury. [www.buzzfeednews.com]

Have you not noticed that Trump's lawyers haven't covered themselves with glory recently. Rudy Giuliani alternates between embarrassing himself and implicating Trump. Trump's lawyers lost a string of cases to hide his tax returns.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 11:14PM
Curt,

To use a reference recently employed by po, the jury voted guilty in To Kill a Mockingbird.

Trump's case on the tax returns was weak. The case for impeachment, from what I can tell, will also be weak.

But, we will see.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 11:18PM
"The fact po, D and Curt trust so deeply in Schiff suggests that this is much more wish than realism-based expectation." -pb

I simply have seen absolutely nothing to suggest that he's doing anything other than a competent and thorough job. In fact, his competence seems to be met by the level of right wing attacks against him. Republicans only attack that which they fear.


"I still suspect that he'll be eaten alive when the process goes public," -pb

Over what...?

.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 11:22PM
He's a pathological liar. I'd start with that.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 11:25PM
"To use a reference recently employed by po, the jury voted guilty in To Kill a Mockingbird." -pb

Much as the Republicans will regardless of how the evidence utterly condemns Individual-1. The jury in To Kill a Mockingbird was already determined to see Tom found guilty and hanged. Evidence, schevidence... facts, schmacts. And in your book, that was justice being served. It was certainly justice being acted out, but real justice had little to do with the outcome of that case. As it will when the GOP lets Orange Anus Face totally skate for his obvious crimes.

.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 11:29PM
Quote
Ponderer

I simply have seen absolutely nothing to suggest that he's doing anything other than a competent and thorough job. In fact, his competence seems to be met by the level of right wing attacks against him. Republicans only attack that which they fear.

As Indy! pointed out, he was incompetent in the Russia thing.

I doubt the GOPs fear him. My guess is that they resent him for his many lies and, and I know you'll love this word, prevarications.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 11:32PM
"He's a pathological liar. I'd start with that." -OD

You have no case for that accusation. Has he ever told a lie or anything that wasn't true? Sure, perhaps. I'm open to looking at any of that. Pathological though...? No. Sorry. No case for that at all.

The only reason that conservatives ever accuse anyone of being a "pathological" liar when no one they ever call that actually is one is because their Orange Lord God and Master is indisputably and unmistakably one with a long, uninterrupted track record of non-stop daily lies going back over decades.

But hey, conservative projection and all you know.

.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 11:38PM
"As Indy! pointed out, he was incompetent in the Russia thing." -pb

How was he incompetent? For not forcing Mueller somehow to criminally charge Individual-1 with all the crimes that his report laid out with all the evidence and testimonies that he did? There is a ten-count, plug-and-play Impeachment Kit in that report all ready and set that he handed to Congress to act on.

My guess is that people are going to be stunned when things from that report start dovetailing with things that are coming out now and will be soon.

Again, it's kind of silly to debate about a subject with you that you obviously never followed for even five minutes. I don't even know what Indy! expected Schiff to do that he didn't.

.
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 11, 2019 11:50PM
Po,

Read Indy!'s post.

Schiff straight out lied about evidence he had in the Russia investigation. Yikes, man!
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 12, 2019 12:10AM
Quote
pb
Po,

Read Indy!'s post.

Schiff straight out lied about evidence he had in the Russia investigation. Yikes, man!

Indy has similar motivations as Trump to discount any evidence of Russian election meddling. Trump says "I believe Putin" because to admit otherwise casts doubt on the legitimacy of his election. Likewise, Indy cannot accept the notion of Russian election interference might have undermined Hillary Clinton's campaign with false accusations and innuendo. Also if Indy were to admit that Russians were complicit, that tends to negate the Wikileaks hacking that supposedly revealed that Hillary won the Democratic nomination by rigging the system.

It's naive to think that the Russians didn't meddle in our election, when there is plenty of evidence that they meddle in the elections of other nations. This is from today's New York Times...
Quote
How Russia Meddles Abroad for Profit: Cash, Trolls and a Cult Leader
Madagascar has little obvious strategic value for the Kremlin or the global balance of power. But Russians were there during an election, offering bribes, spreading disinformation and recruiting an apocalyptic cult leader.
[www.nytimes.com]

Also, I realize that you don't like to have your opinion swayed by evidence or information, pb, but keep an eye on the Roger Stone trial...
Quote
“THE TRUTH LOOKED BAD FOR DONALD TRUMP”: THE ROGER STONE TRIAL IS DELIVERING MUCH OF WHAT MUELLER DIDN’T
In their opening statement, federal prosecutors quickly made clear that Stone was in direct contact with then candidate Trump and his campaign officials about WikiLeaks and the timing and release of emails stolen from the Democratic National Committee and the Clinton campaign, speaking with him on numerous occasions about the email dumps during the summer of 2016. They argued that Stone’s decision to obfuscate his purported contacts with WikiLeaks and its founder,Julian Assange, to Congress was done to benefit Trump. “The evidence in this case will show that Roger Stone lied to the House Intelligence Committee because the truth looked bad for the Trump campaign and the truth looked bad for Donald Trump,” Aaron Zelinsky, an assistant U.S. attorney and veteran of the Mueller probe, declared in court Wednesday.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 12, 2019 12:20AM
Curt- "Madagascar has little obvious strategic value for the Kremlin or the global balance of power. But Russians were there during an election, offering bribes, spreading disinformation and recruiting an apocalyptic cult leader." (fm the NYTIMES)

Just another thought. Toamasina is a deep water port capable of the Soviet's putting a sub base there. Along with their southern fleet, this might give them a distinct advantage from the Arabian Sea and Indian Ocean (including access to Diego Garcia, which houses a US Air Force/ Navy/ Marine military base).
pb
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 12, 2019 12:24AM
Curt,

We'll keep an eye on that trial.
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 12, 2019 01:36AM
Indy seeks and speaks the truth. That's all there is to it.

Tuk said exactly what I'm talking about - Schiff said he had seen "enough evidence" (or something to that effect) that Trump was colluding (or whatever you want to call it) with Russia. In the end, he came up empty. That obviously makes him a liar. The incompetence part is jumping with the lie. That would be the same as a lawyer saying my client is innocent before he's seen the police report, talked to all the potential witnesses and has all the pertinent facts.

Quote
Curt
Indy has similar motivations as Trump to discount any evidence of Russian election meddling. Trump says "I believe Putin" because to admit otherwise casts doubt on the legitimacy of his election. Likewise, Indy cannot accept the notion of Russian election interference might have undermined Hillary Clinton's campaign with false accusations and innuendo. Also if Indy were to admit that Russians were complicit, that tends to negate the Wikileaks hacking that supposedly revealed that Hillary won the Democratic nomination by rigging the system.

It's naive to think that the Russians didn't meddle in our election, when there is plenty of evidence that they meddle in the elections of other nations. This is from today's New York Times...


I could give a rat's ass about Hillary. I said she would lose and she lost. If you guys feel more comfortable blaming it on Russia and $46K worth of Facebook ads - that's up to you. Those of us with no horse in the game understand that going down that road makes Hillary's loss an even more devastating indictment of her campaign... ahem... "skills". She spent something like $1.2B in 2016 which should have easily brought more voters to her if anyone actually wanted her to be president. Plus rigging the DNC, picking her own opponent for the general, buying up super delegates, etc...
Re: Po, Donna, even Curt don't Realize that Adam Schiff in Merely Hamilton Burger
November 12, 2019 01:46AM
Quote
Indy!
Tuk said exactly what I'm talking about - Schiff said he had seen "enough evidence" (or something to that effect) that Trump was colluding (or whatever you want to call it) with Russia.

Part of a continuing series: Indy agrees with his fellow "progressives", pb and Tuk, about "Russia,Russia,Russia" and the "collusion hoax".
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